Preflop: How to react to 3bets when bluff 4bets aren't possible?

    • Preflop: How to react to 3bets when bluff 4bets aren't possible?


      I play mostly live games and have a general preflop question. I tried to google this but didn't find any specific answer on my question.

      I am wondering how to construct my preflop range vs. 3bets when the stack sizes/SPR don't allow me to bluff 4bet without commiting myself. I feel really lost in these spots. I give you two examples:


      2/4€ / 400€ eff stack

      Hero (MP) raises to 12€, HJ calls, CO calls, Button raises to 74€ ... Hero ?

      If I 4bet to let's say 170€, I'm always commited to pay off the all in (400€) once my opponents decides to jam it. Should we therefore use a depolarized 4bet range and only 4bet (or jam) hands we are willed to stack off? In this spot I would be pretty lost with holdings like T9s, QJs, KQs, 99 ... because calling also kind of sucks oop in this spot



      2/5€ with 10€ live straddle on, 500€ stack

      Hero (HJ) raises to 30€, Button 3bets to 100€, Hero ?

      Can we even have a calling range here or it does it just realize too poorly? Should we just play jam or fold with a depolarized range?

      I would be very grateful for any kind of feedback on this topic because I really find myself having problems in these spots.

    • Not the one to know for certain, but hopefully you'll find this useful in any way :)

      It might be a bit easier to look at these spots from the big blinds' perspective -

      1) 100BBs effective. HERO MP raises to 3BB, HJ calls, CO calls, BU raises to 18.5BB. In this case you're getting 15.5/44.5 = 34.8% odds to continue, but if we look at your equity (quick look at equilab)

      you can't really continue, especially because you're OOP which should make your realized equity even lower.

      As you said, with the min-4bet you already would be putting (18.5-3 = 15.5. 15.5+18.5 = 34, hopefully it's correct how you count the min-raise) in enough money that makes yourself commited in case villain 5bet jams, not to mention this doesn't work well for neither your bluffs, nor value, so neither calling the SQ, nor min-4betting looks attractive. However, considering how much money is in the pot already (3BB open, 3BB flat, 3BB flat, 18.5BB SQ, 1.5BB from the blinds = ) - 29BB, if you managed to just pick that up preflop, that's already 1/3 of the stack without even seeing the flop which is major win, so even though it's important who is the squeezer and what kind of range do you think he's playing, shoving or folding seems to be the way to go. So if the squeezing is quite liberal i would start by opening a tighter range and reacting to these big squeezes in 4bet jam-or-fold manner.

      2) (F straddles n that other live crap :D ) Straddle makes it so the effective stack is 50BBs to begin with. HJ HERO raises to 3BB, BU raises to 10BB. A min-4bet would be to 17BB (right?) and so that's again already a commiting amount, so not really an option. As for flatting, again, your odds are 7/21.5=32.55% (ALL OF THIS IS ASSUMING IN BOTH CASES ALL THE OTHER PLAYERS LEFT TO ACT HAVE FOLDED), but should be diminished because of your positional disadvantage, so in case you want to have a calling range you would have to be including monsters in there too (KK-AA), but that's with the assumption that you need to have a calling range there in the first place, while in reality, being able to pick up those 14.5BBs (Your 3BB open, 10BB 3bet, 1.5BB from the blinds), which in reality is 29BB if there we're no straddle is again a huge win, so not opening as wide and proceeding by jamming or folding would be my guess as the way to go in this case too

      EDIT : in case you're worried that villain might be squeezing a too wide range, keep in mind that he's risking very much, like in #1 example, risking 18.5 to win 10.5 (open, 2 flats, blinds) which makes him need 10.5/18.5 = 56.7% at least that many folds and since his sizing is so big, he's forcing you to play 4bet jam or fold strategy, which destroys the equity of his SQ "bluffs" (he bluff SQ, you jam, he's forced to fold - 0% realized eq), so:

      1) If you know that he's squeezing a reasonable range, you will punish him by folding hands that he would like you to continue with (like the ones i've cheked the equity with, you can't really back-jam those);
      2) If you know that he's squeezing wider than he should, you will punish his SQ bluffs by jamming and taking the whole pot right there preflop;

      The post was edited 4 times, last by motiejus ().